LE vs civilian gun fights, and the training implications thereof

There’s a difference between what happens in LE gunfights and civilian self-defense shootings.  These differences indicate different training methods and techniques.  The idiot below has a long-winded explanation of some of them.

Note the data from Tom Givens referenced in the vid is explained here.


3 thoughts on “LE vs civilian gun fights, and the training implications thereof

  1. Hi Ralph. Years ago I built my program to meet the TWO scenarios you bring up – contact distance shootings and owning the 0-7 yard distance since what I saw happening in the field was consistently happening at the distance. Beyond the distance was , for the most part, in the realm of felony stop distances – approximately 10 yards but in an environment that was not the typical spontaneous combat shootings that you are addressing in the video. So, what you have brought forward in this video is a mirror of what I saw and built training blocks around. It’s reality.

    One quick note that I think helped train for the 0-3 yard distance that LE faces frequently. I found that spending the training time teaching the methods and allowing the student to practice them using air soft and role players worked really well. There is a world of difference between doing drills at that distance against a person as opposed to live fire on the range. Of course live fire should be done on the range but developing the methods can be done safely and relatively cheaply with air soft.

    The final point is to ensure combat shooting methodology taught matches the high speed, spontaneous nature of these combat shootings. Combining proper methods at frequently encountered distances will reap great benefits in combat shootings.

    Thanks for making this video. If your information is understood and put into training programs, lives will be saved.

    Lou Chiodo


  2. This makes perfect sense to me. I would add, however, that a different criminal weapon such as a knife vs. a gun, might change their (criminal) approach. Criminals are smart enough to realize the pros and cons of different weapons. They know to stay just out of arms reach when using a pistol. They also know that much of a knife’s intimidation factor is lost if you are out of arms reach. Complicating it all is that they try not to show their cards until the last second. I’m just trying to add to the conversation, not detract from an excellent article. Thank you for it.


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